[Pagan Prompt] Should you be vegetarian and pagan?

[moonvoice]

Many characterize paganism as an umbrella term "earth-centered" religions. Following from that there is an idea that pagans should be dedicated to honoring all life and be caretakers of the earth. The next jump made by many is that pagans should therefore refrain from eating meat. What do you think? Do pagans have a responsibility to honor all life and thus be vegetarians?


Following from that there is an idea that pagans should be dedicated to honoring all life and be caretakers of the earth. The next jump made by many is that pagans should therefore refrain from eating meat. What do you think? Do pagans have a responsibility to honor all life and thus be vegetarians?

This is, to me, such a flawed premise.

The thing is, it firstly assumes that pagans can only honour nature by 'letting it live' all the time. It completely denies the importance, and sacredness of death; and it ignorantly forgets that there is a natural life/death cycle with everything we do. I actually find it quite anti-nature, and anti-pagan, to forget that there is a natural life and death cycle that we are constantly a part of.

I mean we kill and eat plants while they're still living, even vegetarians need to own their part in killing to eat. Plants aren't exempt from being alive, sacred, or even potentially sentient just because they lack a central nervous system or can't scream in pain. We know that plants don't like being damaged and eaten, because many plants have evolved sophisticated and sometimes energy-consuming techniques to prevent it from happening.

I think that all life is equal, regardless of whether I can anthropomorphise it or not. I think that plants are equal to animals, and therefore it is hypocritical of me to value the lives of animals over the lives of plants just because we don't hear plants scream or see them struggle. I also find it kind of amusing that some vegetarians feel more superior than non-vegetarians, yet they are actually consuming a living being while it is still alive. Those fresh, raw vegetables are all living beings that still have a chance of living a full life in the ground - it is our call to strip it of its life in our digestive tract; often without thinking about it or even saying thank you for the sacrifice of the plants.

You would also hope that all vegetarians didn't ever kill any insects or trap mice or basically hurt anything that was 'animal like,' if that is their primary reason for eating vegies - 'respecting nature.' You can't logically have it both ways. If you refuse to eat meat because you see the sacredness in life, then how can you justify not being heart-broken every time you step on an ant, or inhale a dust mite?

The thing is, I feel that if people are using the 'respecting life / sacredness of life' reason as a justification for vegetarianism (as opposed to health reasons, or even just not wanting to eat battery meat / factory farmed animals (who does?)) then they are simply refusing to give the same sense of equality to all animals, let alone all living things. It's convenient, but I'm not sure if it's a really respectable way of being as a pagan.

I think there are a lot of flawed assumptions amongst those who think that eating vegetables only is more respectful than ever eating meat. Assumptions based on misunderstandings of the life/death cycle and the sacredness of death, assumptions based on the value of animals over plants, assumptions even based on cuter animals over the less cute ones (like insects or dust mites or mosquitoes)... so my answer is actually No. There is no reason that a pagan should be a vegetarian because they are pagan. There are plenty of reasons to be vegetarian, but 'respecting life,' is one of the flawed reasons, imho.

Comments

[jamminbison.livejournal.com]

And I think humans, as top of the food chain on many levels (except polar bears ._.), should be allowed to eat whatever they want no matter what. Yes, yes, it's terrible what they do to the animals in factory farms, but I'm hungry and that piece of celery just ain't going to cut it. And free-range meat, from what I seen, costs more and some of us just don't have the extra cash and time to pick through meat that may or may not be from a factory farm.

[paleo.livejournal.com]

Do you *really* believe that might makes right and instant gratification and cost are most important even in the face of obvious abuse?

[jamminbison.livejournal.com]

...yes, especially when I'm hungry, my family doesn't have a huge a whole lot of time to shop around for food and then pay a lot for it, and driving a bunch of miles to the nearest "organic" store would cost me a weekend's worth of pay. It's insane to ask a person to spend a lot more and waste a lot of time for that precious cow that admittedly, doesn't have the same amount of brain activity as a human to know what's going on except that 'ow, this hurts, I should try and run away'.

I already said that yes it is said the conditions that some animals are in, but contraty to popular belief most of those videos you've seen from good ol' fanatic PETA are from a few decades ago and most of that doesn't go on any longer. Are there exceptions? Yes, but for the most part the world isn't filled of people going 'lol, let's purposely harm the animals even if it sometimes takes longer to do so or just because we want to piss people off'.

And I don't care what they did to those chickens, because it's delicious. Omnomnomnom~

[amberfishy.livejournal.com]

Ahh thankyou for enlightening me as to exactly what kind of people the world is filled of.

[jamminbison.livejournal.com]

Because me eating factory meat automatically makes me the worst person in the world. For all you know I could be the reincarnate of Mother Theresa and be spreading peace and love throughout the world.

I can't wait for someone to go to their resturaunt of choice and go:
"Yes, but, is this burger from a free-range farm?"
"Oh, yes, sir! We decreased our profits and increased our expendable cash to please hippies like you!"

Sorry to tell you, but sadly, this world is run by money. Can we change it? Unlikely and if I did have all the time in the world and the money in the world to go find this unspoiled meat, which still includes killing animals for the lulz, I would. But I can't. Happy?

At least I don't go around and throw my trash on the freeway and I still recycle, turn off the lights, and conserve energy and resources as best I can.

Oohhhhh, such a horrible person. Woe is me!!! DX

[amberfishy.livejournal.com]

Thanks for letting me know, also, how the world is run! I didn't know that either. And no, we definitely can't change it, you're right. That one drop in the ocean stuff, what a load of baloney. You are right. And I don't know anything about you, except that you seem to be young and apparently, quite wonderful.

However I'm going to content myself with continuing to be a deluded hippie, who surely cannot continue to articulate witty banter any further on this joyful subject.

[jamminbison.livejournal.com]

Whoa, alright, k. It's nice to think that yes, we can change the world and trying is good and all, but if we sit back and look, it doesn't seem to be working. Corporations promise to make the world a greener place. One example being Six Flags's promise to put recycling bins in their parks so they are in plain sight and accesible. Did they? No, at least not at their biggest and most popular Great Adventure location.

So, wth? Individual efforts do help on a very small scale, but if that big corporation in the sky like Apple [still doesn't have a policy against using their mercury infested computers] and so on and so forth. Yes, we can tell them as the public over and over agian to do something, but they still waste. Frito-Lay/Pepsico spouts how green they are when in their warehouses they still throw plastic willy-nilly out into the streets and trash their grounds.

And ohyeah, let's throw the card around that "YOU THINK YOU'RE SO GREAT JUST BECAUSE YOU MADE AN OBVIOUS STATEMENT" thing. Sorry, I was just making a point and sorry I have no eligibility to state my opinion because I'm young and have no right to say anything. You're totally right. Let's sling some more mud. :D

And I didn't say you're a deluded hippie, but some of these ideals just don't work in the real world as much as we would like them to. :|

[paleo.livejournal.com]

**And I don't care what they did to those chickens, because it's delicious. Omnomnomnom~**

Wow. Just wow. I'm more amazed than angry at such a gleeful admission of stunted empathy and selfishness.

**Yes, but for the most part the world isn't filled of people going 'lol, let's purposely harm the animals even if it sometimes takes longer to do so or just because we want to piss people off'.**

Purposeful abusers aren't the main problem in Western society. The main problem are folks like you who help exuse the abusers because they make "delicious" stuff. Ignorance I can forgive...mostly. But when someone KNOWS that thousands of hours of pain and millions of severed neurons went into giving them half an hour of pleasure and can still respond with a sophomoric Omnononom their whole personality is called into question.

[jamminbison.livejournal.com]

It's called a joke and a reference to a comedian. I'm sorry that you didn't get it as I know it was obscure. :-/

The way people eat doesn't determine their personaility. I've never heard of that in my life. "OH, you eat eggs, so you must believe in cramming chickens into small cages just for your hearty breakfast! What a cruel person you are!" lol, whut?

I'm not excusing it, as I already said how horrible it is, despite half those videos being old and thus irrelevant. I sympathize with those horses in the meat farms who are abused, but I just don't want to join PETA or AFL which are highlyhighlyhigly controversial. I do my part by on occasion donating to animal societies or dropping off food at the local shelter or whatever, but I'm also a normal consumer. Normal meaning I'm not too picky by picking a sect like vegetarianism or veganism. Stuff like that.

[paleo.livejournal.com]

**It's called a joke and a reference to a comedian. I'm sorry that you didn't get it as I know it was obscure. :-/**
*nods* Okay, no worries. I personally don't even like joking about animal abuse, but if I had known what you said was in jest rather than a statement of your true opinion I wouldn't have been as harsh in my response.

You are very right to be wary of PETA, but their existance doesn't invalidate the need to fight for animal welfare. If you are looking for much more reasonable and practicle advice on living a compassionate and animal-friendly life, I highly recommend Jane Goodall's books and website. She does not seek to make people feel like there is One Right Way to love animals but is still firm on always seeking to expand our education of the problem.

[jamminbison.livejournal.com]

It's all good. ;3

Thanks, I'll look into those sites. As for pissing you off, sorry about that. I just wanted to throw in the non-pagan, more relaxed view about consumption, the view that many people take. I'm all for the totemism and what have you, but the whole being picky about what you put in the engine is a strange subject for lots of people~